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In his new book, The Splendid and the Vile, Erik Larson tackles one of the most heralded figures in modern Western history: Winston Churchill.


The subjects you’ve tackled over the course of your career are quite broad and varied. Is there any common thread that unites your interests?
There’s no particular common thread, other than story. I’m always looking for compelling historical events that can be rendered in narrative form, with a beginning, middle and end, so that readers can get caught up in the action and live through it as if they didn’t know the ending. So that’s first. But a corollary motive is to answer the question: What was it like to have lived through that event? Then it becomes a matter of finding the right real-life characters whose experience provides the richest insight.

What compelled you to zoom in and write about this particular slice—just his first year as prime minister—of Churchill’s life and the lives of his family?
What drove me was an interest not so much in exploring that first year but rather in learning how Churchill and his family and inner circle actually went about surviving Germany’s aerial campaign against Britain. I mean, how really do you cope with eight months of near-nightly bombings—essentially a succession of 9/11s? It just happened that the Luftwaffe’s campaign coincided, rather neatly, with that first year. In fact, the year ended with an intense raid that occurred one year to the day after Churchill took office.


ALSO IN BOOKPAGE: Read our review of The Splendid and the Vile.


You’ve described this book as a kind of “Downton on Downing,” because of the way the book chronicles not just Churchill but other people in his life during this period. What were some of the challenges of researching these other figures?
It’s always relatively easy to research so-called “Great Man History,” because leaders like Churchill leave rich archives of documents and vast amounts of scholarship. But often the histories written about them give short shrift to the people who were crucial in helping them get through the day and to the fact that, even in the midst of great events, our heroes still had to deal with such quotidian matters as paying bills and resolving domestic dramas. It’s these little corners of history that most appeal to me, and that can be the most difficult to unearth. But the reward is great, because as I’ve found time and time again, when you open a new window on a subject, you invariably find material that other scholars, looking for other things, are likely to have overlooked.

With so much having been recorded about Churchill already, did you uncover anything in your research that surprised you about the man?
I was surprised and delighted at every turn, actually—especially by the man’s sense of humor and his ability, even in the midst of the most awful events imaginable, to step up and just have fun—whether doing bayonet drills in the great hall of his country home or singing along to “Run Rabbit Run,” one of his favorite songs. Of course, his idea of fun also happened to include watching air raids from the nearest rooftop.

Why are we so interested in Churchill? What makes so many writers want to write about him, and so many readers want to read about him?
Maybe because there’s a heroic clarity to the man that seems so absent in the leaders we have today. Also, there’s always that underlying mystery: How did he do it? That’s what most intrigued me. My goal was to capture a richer, deeper sense of the man and his day-to-day experience and of those who helped him endure—because believe me, he did not do it alone. He relied heavily on family and his closest advisers for wisdom, comfort and simple distraction.

Your footnotes contain fascinating stories and insights that weren’t included in the main text. Would you share your favorite?
I do love salting the notes with little stories. That’s my reward for those stalwart souls who, like me, enjoy a good footnote. I’m a bit hesitant to give these stories away, but I suppose my favorite is the one in which Churchill’s long-suffering bodyguard, Inspector Thompson, describes the uniquely withering quality of Clementine Churchill’s glare whenever she became annoyed with him—which, apparently, was quite often.

“Even in the midst of great events, our heroes still had to deal with such quotidian matters as paying bills and resolving domestic dramas. It’s these little corners of history that most appeal to me . . .”

This book, like your others, is both methodically researched and engagingly narrative. Do you frontload your writing process with research, or do research and writing happen simultaneously?
My ideal is to finish all my research before I begin writing. This never happens. Invariably I get to a point where I feel that I’ve just got to start writing, whether the research is done or not. The story starts begging to come out, scratching at the door. So I’ll start writing those passages for which the underlying source material is most complete. I should point out, however, that the research never does end. I keep reading and tweaking until the final page-proofs are finished and the book is ready to be printed. And then I hope to God that I got everything right—which is why, for this book, I asked three top Churchill experts to read the final manuscript and hired a professional fact-checker to give it a line-by-line, quote-by-quote examination.

What’s the significance of the title, The Splendid and the Vile?
It derives from an observation made by one of Churchill’s private secretaries, John Colville, a central character in the book. In his diary he describes a particularly dramatic night raid, which he watched through a bedroom window. He was struck by the contrast between the beauty of the interplay of searchlights, guns and fire, and the awful reality it represented.

Are there any contemporary figures who embody Churchill’s leadership style—particularly, as you put it, “his knack for making people feel loftier, stronger, and, above all, more courageous”?
At the moment, no. Sadly, quite the opposite.

Do you have a favorite Churchill portrayal in film or TV?
No. Frankly, I think they mostly miss the mark, invariably leaning toward caricature. I must note that during the three or four years I worked on this book, I avoided watching any film or television portrayals of Churchill, so as not to distort my own emerging sense of the man. One of my favorite moments in my book is one windy night in the garden at 10 Downing Street, when Churchill, on the verge of a devastating decision, desperately needed the comfort and advice of a close friend, and. . . . Oops, too bad. I see we’ve run out of time.

 

Author photo © Nina Subin

In his new book, The Splendid and the Vile, Erik Larson tackles one of the most heralded figures in modern Western history: Winston Churchill.


The subjects you’ve tackled over the course of your career are quite broad and varied. Is there…

Bess Kalb's heartfelt, hilarious memoir pays tribute to her beloved—and opinionated—grandma.
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After more than 300 recorded audiobooks, acclaimed narrator and voice-over actor Saskia Maarleveld knows that every audiobook requires something special. But what’s the difference between narrating a historical book versus a biography of a beloved icon? Comparing two of Maarleveld’s performances, The Queens of Animation: The Untold Story of the Women Who Transformed the World of Disney and Made Cinematic History and Carrie Fisher: A Life on the Edge, offers a look into an audio narrator’s preparation, devotion and ability to roll with the punches.

Here she discusses a day behind the audiobook curtain, what it’s like to deliver Carrie Fisher’s jokes and why narrating nonfiction is so much harder than fiction.


Tell me a bit about transforming books into audiobooks. How do you prepare, and what do you enjoy about the preparation? From one project to the next, how much do you change your approach to each audiobook?
Once I have a script, I will first and foremost read it through. That’s the most important prep you can do: knowing the book, its characters and flow. Depending on the genre, there will then be a certain amount of research to do. Looking up correct pronunciations is one of the most important. I also like to know about the author and more about the subject matter, especially if it is a genre like historical fiction or nonfiction. I tend to not “overprep” a book, as for me the most fun part is having the story feel fresh in the booth. You want to know it but not have belabored it such that the words and characters don’t feel alive. Being open to what might come out in the booth is part of the fun!

What’s a day in the studio like for you?
I live in New York City and am lucky to be surrounded by the best audiobook studios and producers, so I go into a bunch of different studios to record. I always have an engineer and sometimes a director. A usual day for us is 10 a.m. to 4 or 5 p.m. We take bathroom and water breaks when we need them and have a lunch hour, but otherwise I’m in the booth recording the entire time! I like these longer days, as you can really get on a roll with whatever you are working on, recording usually about three finished hours or more in a session. Surprisingly, it’s usually my brain that starts to fray at the end of the day before my voice!

“It puts a lot of pressure on the narrator when you are trying to portray an icon like Carrie Fisher—you need to get it right!”

I’d love to discuss two audiobooks you recently narrated: Carrie Fisher and The Queens of Animation. What was most important to you as a narrator as you approached each audiobook? Did one pose more challenges than the other?
Both of these were nonfiction, which was a thrill as I mainly record fiction. Being nonfiction, it was important to me that I respect the stories of these people, doing thorough research before getting in the booth. For Carrie Fisher, I watched a ton of interviews with her to get a feel for her voice, personality and sense of humor. I watched a lot of clips from Disney movies to revisit the scenes I was describing in The Queens of Animation. This prep helps the words not fall flat when they are being read; there is life and movement behind what I am describing to the listener. This comes through most when I have a clear picture on my head.

Carrie FisherIt was a special treat to hear your ability to deliver Carrie Fisher’s jokes. What is it like to tap into an icon like Carrie Fisher? How is it different from tapping into a fictional character?
I loved having the opportunity to learn more about Carrie Fisher, a person I knew from on screen but now had to embody in a much more personal way. Having read the book ahead of time obviously gave me so much of what I needed, but also the interviews and clips I watched helped me with delivering the Carrie lines in ways that embodied her. It puts a lot of pressure on the narrator when you are trying to portray an icon like Carrie Fisher—you need to get it right! Whereas with fictional characters, you have much more room for interpretation and imagination.

The Queens of AnimationWith The Queens of Animation, our audio columnist especially loved the way you draw readers in, “like [you’re] confiding a dark secret.” Is this something you set out to do intentionally for this book?
Nonfiction can feel a little impersonal if the narrator just reads the words on the page and remains removed from them. It’s hard because you aren’t narrating as a character, so the more you can make the listener feel like you are talking directly to them, telling them the story, the more personal it becomes. I’m glad that came across in this project!

Does your work impact how you read?
I have always loved reading, so unfortunately these days it is very rare that I have the time to read for pleasure as I am always reading for work! And when I do occasionally have the time, it takes time to turn off the narrator side of my brain thinking, How do I pronounce that word? How does this character avoids sound? I should highlight this! I thought when I stopped working to have my daughter, I would have time to get back into reading for pleasure again, but with a newborn, reading is a whole new challenge!

What do audiobooks offer that a book can’t? And considering how much audiobooks are booming, why do you think we’re being drawn to this medium more and more?
Time is precious, and these days so many of us are constantly multitasking. Sitting down with a book is a luxury, something you have to focus on not only with your mind but also your body. Being able to listen to an audiobook while driving, ironing, cooking, etc., is such a gift, as we don’t have to stop the busy work our bodies are doing while escaping into the world of a story.

What do you believe are your greatest strengths as a reader of books? What is the most rewarding or coolest thing you get to bring to this experience through your reading?
I was trained as an actor, so my skill at creating characters is something I take pride in, and I also specialize in accent and dialect work. Also, as mentioned in an earlier question, I aim to connect the listener to the story in a very personal way. I want them to feel I am speaking directly to them, drawing them into whatever world we are sharing. If I achieve this, I think my job is done!

What’s one thing people might not expect about your role as narrator?
I work on many projects that I get really attached to, and it is surprisingly hard to read that last word and know my time with this tale has ended. It is a very intimate experience to share a story and embody characters, so after hours and days of disappearing into a book, leaving it behind can be very sad!

 

ALSO IN BOOKPAGE: Read about Saskia Maarleveld’s narration of Carrie Fisher and The Queens of Animation.

After more than 300 recorded audiobooks, acclaimed narrator and voice-over actor Saskia Maarleveld knows that every audiobook requires something special in its reading. Here she discusses a day behind the audiobook curtain, what it’s like to deliver Carrie Fisher’s jokes and why narrating nonfiction is so much harder than fiction.
Sarah Ramey talks about the intersection of medicine and misogyny, laid bare in her powerful (and, against the odds, hilarious) memoir.
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Everything Samantha Irby touches turns to laughter, and this Q&A is no exception. The humor writer and essayist talked to BookPage about moving to Kalamazoo, Michigan, working in Hollywood and writing her newest book, Wow, No Thank You.


You are an amazingly candid writer, offering essays on everything from sex to your tough childhood to body issues. What topics are off limits for you? What topics would you like to tackle but haven’t yet?
THIS IS A TRICK QUESTION. I can’t tell you my off-limit topics because then it’ll become a whole thing and your follow-up question will be, “Well why don’t you write about that?” and then I’ll end up talking about a thing I don’t write about and then we will continue in a back-and-forth loop until one of us dies. So I’ma say this: I try to only write what I know about, which is why 99% of my work is about myself, because I don’t know anything and I can’t read!

You say your stepchildren are not allowed to read your books (as part of your hilarious “detachment parenting” theory). Surely you let your wife read your work, though. What is her general reaction?
I don’t let my wife read anything in which she isn’t specifically referenced before I send it to my editor, because I can’t shake off criticism. I don’t read or listen to anything anyone who isn’t editing me has to say about a thing I’m working on because the instant I hear it, it becomes a part of my body. That “this could be tighter” or “this part is confusing” crawls inside my ear and burrows its way into my brain where it will live until I pass away, still fretting about why my sentence structure is bad. I don’t read interviews or reviews or anything about myself ever, because I don’t have that gene that allows you to take critiques in stride and keep it pushing. Anyway, it was written into our vows that she is required to say that she likes every single thing I commit to the page, so I’ll never know what she actually feels, but I believe that she’s a fan.

“Nothing is fun when it feels like your life depends on it. That sounds extremely dramatic, but it’s real.”

It was fascinating to read about your time in Hollywood working in the writers’ room for the show “Shrill.” Do you see yourself working in Hollywood again?
I just wrapped a different Hollywood job! Although, we worked in Chicago this time, and the show shoots in Chicago, so it was just like going home to chill with my friends for a few weeks, not like fancy Hollywood. I was just in the writers’ room for Showtime’s “Work in Progress,” a show I was absolutely obsessed with when it first came out, so when they asked if I would join the room for season two, I leapt at the chance. I don’t know though. I’m not 19 and optimistic, show business fucking sucks, and everyone lies to your face while telling you how much they love you, and there’s absolutely zero transparency, which I never expect under any circumstances, but it’s jarring when it happens, and making the choice to be a 40-year-old beginner in an industry like that??? No thank you! I’m too old to be subjecting myself over and over again to that shit! I’m sure publishing has its detractors, too, but at least I’m already successful at that. So I’ll work in Hollywood when cool opportunities to work with genuine people I like present themselves to me, but I will absolutely never be a rabbit chasing breathlessly after that elusive stick.

What are you most proud of in your career so far?
That I spent 14 years at the same job (working in an animal hospital in the burbs), punching the same clock, and that I was dependable and reliable and really good at it. Creative writing isn’t a career, it’s an unrelenting anxiety dream in which my money and future are tied to the whims of people I’ve never met and a market over which I have absolutely no control. However, many years from now when I’m filling out the application to be a regional manager at Target because no one reads anymore, no one is gonna give a shit that once upon a time I wrote some books. They want to know that I have exceptional customer service skills, which I absolutely do.


ALSO IN BOOKPAGE: Read our starred review of Wow, No Thank You.


You moved from Chicago to Kalamazoo, Michigan (which, until embarrassingly recently, I didn’t know was a real place). What was the hardest part about leaving a major city? What was a welcome surprise about the move?
The best thing about having moved is that there are a precious few people here who ever ask me for anything, and that is the best thing in the fucking world. It didn’t really dawn on me how great getting away from a city full of people with my phone number was until the first time someone hit me up like, “Hey dude, can you do my show for free next Thursday night at 11:59 p.m., I can comp you one well drink,” and I got to respond “SORRY NO I DON’T LIVE IN CHICAGO ANYMORE.” I miss my friends, and 90% of my waking hours feel like I am going to die without being in close proximity to them, but Jesus Christ, EVERYONE HAS A FRIGGIN PODCAST, and they all want you to come to their apartments after work and awkwardly try to hold a microphone while shooing away the dog, and I don’t have to make up an excuse not to do that anymore! “I can’t, I live in another state!” is the perfect way to get out of every in-person interaction I would die rather than suffer through. Technology is catching up to me, though, and people have started to pivot to “Hey, we can just Skype!” or whatever, but I just got a new phone number, so now I can avoid that shit, too. Everyone should move!

You wrote in an online book club chat: “I’m no good in New York. It’s so busy and everyone is mean.” In which cities are you at your best?
The Middle West. Chicago, especially. Detroit is a close second. Also: literally any place with more strip malls than people.

In your acknowledgements, you say you “had a weirdly hard time working on this dumb book.” Why was that?
Wow, you read that far? That’s hilarious! Hmm, well. I don’t know? I didn’t have writer’s block, per se, but I was extremely unmotivated to sit down and write for long stretches of time while working on this collection, and if I had to pin the blame on one thing, it would probably be that this time it was my actual job to be writing a book rather than a fun hobby I get to use as an emotional outlet. Nothing is fun when it feels like your life depends on it. That sounds extremely dramatic, but it’s real.

In your final chapter, you write about how you published your book and allude to the tail-between-your-legs emails asking writers you admire if they would please blurb your book. Who’s written your favorite blurb?
I love all my blurbs equally, especially since they were each so skin-crawlingly humiliating to get, but Jia Tolentino referring to my work as a “snack tray” I think really speaks to the essence of who I am and what I want my writing to be.

“I don’t believe in guilty pleasures. I like what I like, and I don’t care who doesn’t approve.”

You’re pretty active on Twitter, which is simultaneously one of the best and worst places on the internet. Do you encounter a lot of trolls? How do you handle them?
This is so funny because I don’t see myself as active on Twitter? Like, I make a pretty concerted effort to never tweet takes and only occasionally tweet jokes, because that place is a fucking toilet and I hate fighting and I’m also not smart enough to offer an educated opinion about anything that actually matters. I like to retweet things to promote other people while also trying to tweet links to my own shit at a clip that is steady but not nauseatingly so, especially since I decided a few years ago that the only way I could not feel like absolute shit on that website was to use my platform for good. I don’t need to dunk on idiots or react to articles I haven’t read all the way through. I just try to amplify people’s shit while scrolling through to get a laugh. All I want to do is laugh at shit and skim popular articles so that if anyone asks, “Hey, did you read [that thing everyone is talking about] today?” I can convincingly lie and say, “Yes!”

I’m sure I get trolled, but honestly idk about it? I mean, I have so few spicy takes that I can’t imagine what someone would want to climb up my asshole about, but I know there’s always something. Anyway, I have my settings and shit tweaked so that I don’t see anything from anyone I don’t already follow, plus I mute words and phrases I don’t want to see, which is basically the textbook definition of “self-care.” The whole “engage with trolls” thing is just not my fucking bag. The thought of arguing with a faceless stranger online has zero appeal to me? It’s not like people want to have a healthy discussion and exchange of ideas. They want to call you a fat bitch and tell you all the ways you should fucking kill yourself. I can’t dedicate any of the rapidly waning emotional energy I have left to that shit, and besides, I already have the death pills counted out! (jk jk)

I absolutely loved the chapter called “Late 1900s Time Capsule,” in which you offer up a mixtape of songs from the ’90s and divulge what they meant to you. What is your guiltiest pleasure music these days?
I don’t believe in guilty pleasures. I like what I like, and I don’t care who doesn’t approve. I’ve already lived through the years of telegraphing how cool I think I am to people who don’t give a shit, so now I just do whatever I want. That’s not the answer you’re looking for—I know you want me to embarrass myself even though I refuse to feel shame about pop music—so here you go: Every song on Katy Perry’s album “Witness” is a fucking jam, and also I absolutely cannot stop listening to the new Selena Gomez. Has your bloodlust been satisfied???

 

Author photo © Ted Beranis

We talked to Samantha Irby about moving to Kalamazoo, Michigan, working in Hollywood and writing her newest book, Wow, No Thank You.
Dr. Ibram X. Kendi shares about what a book like Stamped would have meant to him as a teenager, what he feels Jason Reynolds added to his work and his advice for young change-makers today.
Interview by

Jennifer Finney Boylan’s father came from a generation of men who didn’t cry in front of others. That’s why the anecdote in her new memoir, Good Boy: My Life in Seven Dogs, about seeing her father cry for the first time is especially poignant.

Her father was watching a TV show, and in one of the episodes, a pet bloodhound dies. The Boylans had raised many dogs themselves by this point and were no strangers to difficult goodbyes with beloved pets. Still, this death was entirely fictional. It was happening on screen, not in real life.

And yet. 

“When I turned to look at my father when the show was over, I was shocked to see that tears had rolled down his cheeks and that he was silently crying,” Boylan writes. “I had never seen my father cry before. He wiped his eyes.

“ ‘Well,’ he said. ‘It’s sad.’ ”

Dogs, Boylan realized, were ideal avatars for explorations of love throughout her life.

This kind of emotional display was uncommon among men not only in Boylan’s family but also in the suburban 1960s and ’70s culture in which she was raised. At the time, Boylan—many decades away from coming out as transgender—looked to the family patriarch for instructions on how to be a man. The emotional strictures of maleness that she saw all around her were already a concern. 

“When you were a kid like me, who is female at heart but no one knows that . . . you’re wondering if your father is the person who’s going to be able to show you how to be in the world,” says Boylan, now 61, from the apartment in New York City where she lives for part of the year. “The idea of being in a world where I couldn’t express emotion more effusively was going to be a challenge for me.”

The Boylans were not a touchy-feely family, she says, but a lot of love existed between them. In adulthood, Boylan has come to realize that one of the ways her family could express love and loss—and one of the ways she could express love and loss—was through their pet dogs. For example, it may be too difficult to say to an older sister who has left for college that her absence hurts. But the family dog, who is also mourning the sister’s absence, intuitively understands. 


ALSO IN BOOKPAGE: Read our review of Good Boy.


Dogs, Boylan realized, were ideal avatars for explorations of love throughout her life. Good Boy begins with Boylan’s childhood as a boy in rural Pennsylvania and ends in the present day, when she is a professor at Barnard College of Columbia University, married to her wife, Deedie, and the mother of two 20-somethings. Along the way, Boylan explores how dogs can teach us about all kinds of love: romantic love, familial love, love between friends and, most importantly, self-love. 

“It’s hard to talk about love without people rolling their eyes, which is just funny if you think about it, because we all know that there is probably nothing more important in the world then loving each other and expressing the love that we feel,” says Boylan. “And yet it’s the thing that we’re probably the worst at.”

Through every section of Good Boy, Boylan shares one life lesson from each of her seven dogs. Playboy, Sausage, Matt the Mutt and others taught Boylan about coping with unrequited love, learning self-respect, reconciling a lifetime of struggle with her gender identity and accepting herself in the face of widespread cultural bigotry.

“Dogs accept you for who you are, no matter who you are, when you can’t accept yourself.”

“Dogs accept you for who you are, no matter who you are, when you can’t accept yourself,” she says. That particular lesson is crucial for Boylan, who unveiled herself (a more fitting phrase than “came out,” she thinks) as transgender at age 40.

Boylan has written about her gender journey in several other memoirs, most notably 2013’s She’s Not There: A Life in Two Genders—the first bestselling book by a transgender American. Good Boy is not exclusively about transgender issues but rather the transformative journey every human goes through in a lifetime. However, Boylan’s experiences as a trans woman, and as the parent of a trans child, are woven throughout. 

Chloe is the family’s only dog at present; she lives in Maine with Deedie while Boylan teaches at Barnard. The family adopted Chloe in 2017, at age 12, when her previous owner became ill. Eventually, it will be time to say goodbye to Chloe, too. 

“Sooner than you know, there’s this thing with a gray face that’s looking at you, saying, ‘You promised to take care of me when the time comes,’ ” Boylan says. “And then you lose the dog, and you weep your brains out.”

In fact, it’s not so different from losing the humans we love in life. “That, in miniature,” she says, “is the process that we go through again and again and again.”

Author photo © Dan Haar

Jennifer Finney Boylan’s dogs taught her about more than mere puppy love. It’s that healing, sustaining love that gets us through life’s letdowns and losses.
We talked to Sweetbitter author Stephanie Danler about her extraordinary new memoir Stray—why it was difficult to write, which memories haunted her and how it changed her perspective on motherhood.
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My phone interview with the 19th poet laureate of the United States happens just days after a series of national tragedies: the deaths of Breonna Taylor, George Floyd and Tony McDade at the hands of police officers, crimes that have plunged the world—and Black communities in particular—into grief and rage. These circumstances momentarily shift the direction of our interview, and it is Natasha Trethewey who asks the first pointed question: “How are you holding up?” Her voice is rich with an accent that reminds me of home (we both grew up in states along the Gulf Coast), but it’s also tinged with something else: the bone-deep knowledge of what it means to survive violent, life-shattering loss.

Trethewey has spent much of her career studying tragedies of both national and personal scale, and her seventh book, Memorial Drive: A Daughter’s Memoir, is no different. It chronicles the life and death of her mother, Gwendolyn Ann Turnbough, who was murdered by her second ex-­husband, Joel Grimmette Jr., in 1985. Though several of Trethewey’s poetry collections deal with the subject of her mother’s murder (in particular Native Guard, which won a Pulitzer Prize in 2007), Memorial Drive is the poet’s first memoir.

The prologue begins with a description of Turnbough’s last professionally taken photograph, in which her black dress is so indistinguishable from the background that her face appears to emerge from darkness “as from the depths of memory.” What follows is a haunting exploration of memory—unpredictable, incomplete and at times obfuscating—through the metaphor of negative space, the area around a subject. Interwoven with the book’s chapters are breathtakingly short vignettes in which Trethewey recalls dreamscapes where her mother is still alive, sometimes older than she was at the time of her death. In the vignette that precedes the first chapter, a piercing light shines from a bullet wound in the center of her mother’s forehead, ringing her face in utter darkness as she asks Trethewey, “Do you know what it means to have a wound that never heals?” 

“I can tell you how remarkable my mother was, and resilient, and strong, and rational. Or I can show you.”

The chapters vary drastically in length, from single pages to much longer ones like “Evidence,” which includes transcripts of Turnbough’s final conversations with the man who would kill her only a few days later. During our call, Trethewey explains that she included these because, even when she’s recalling her own painful past, she is, at heart, a historian. “I’m someone who likes documentary evidence,” she says from her home outside Chicago. “I can tell you how remarkable my mother was, and resilient, and strong, and rational. Or I can show you.”

Memorial Drive achieves all of the above, and the reader’s knowledge of how the story will end does nothing to detract from the beauty of its narrative. Trethewey’s life began in racially segregated Gulfport, Mississippi, where she spent her early years surrounded by her mother’s large family in a town that often treated her parents’ interracial union with open hostility. Nevertheless, she lived happily, doted on by great-aunts, uncles and her young mother, with whom she spent time alone as her father pursued graduate studies in New Orleans.

Tall and graceful, Gwendolyn Turnbough was a stylish, creative woman who made her own clothes and eagerly supported her daughter’s ambitions. For instance, when they moved to Atlanta shortly after Turnbough’s first divorce, a dark space beneath the stairs in their new apartment frightened young Trethewey until her mother transformed it into a playroom planetarium, complete with a desk, books and a velvet cloth sky with stars made from cardboard and aluminum foil. Years later, when Trethewey shared with the family her dreams of being a writer and her stepfather told her it would never happen, Turnbough openly defied him with the full knowledge of the abuse she might later suffer. “She. Will do. WHATEVER. She wants,” she told him in front of their two children. In every instance, Turnbough worked to make use of the spaces available to her daughter, ensuring that they were nurturing and, when possible, safe. “In some ways,” Trethewey says, “all of my relationship with my mother, up to losing her, was shaping me. I think that the love I had from her gave me the kind of resilience that could help me survive losing her.” 


ALSO IN BOOKPAGE: Read our starred review of Memorial Drive.


And yet, in spite of Turnbough’s efforts, the Atlanta years mapped out in Memorial Drive are warped by violence. Trethewey describes Grimmette’s physical abuse of her mother, but also his secret torture of Trethewey herself when the two of them were alone. Grimmette would force her to pack her things, then take her for long drives along Interstate 285, threatening to abandon her at every turn. On another occasion, he broke the lock on her diary and read its contents, after which Trethewey began addressing her entries to him, sometimes with explosive language.

When asked about writing to her stepfather in that diary, which her mother purchased in an attempt to offer her a private place to process her thoughts, Trethewey laughs. “I don’t know how I knew, but I just knew that if I did this, that it would be between us, and it would be this way that I could push back. It wasn’t until much later, once I became a writer, that I began to think about it as a defining moment in terms of me having an audience, or imagining that I was writing for someone to read it. I think that it had everything to do with the writer I became.” This destruction of privacy transformed Trethewey’s personal space into a public one, and the poet began speaking truth to power.

Trethewey’s loss of her mother shortly after turning 19, however, is the point at which she believes the second half of her life began; Turnbough’s death split her daughter’s life into two parts, much like the book itself. “I became a whole other person,” Trethewey tells me. “That’s why I structured things as ‘before’ and ‘after.’ The hardest thing to acknowledge sometimes is I don’t know who I’d be without her death. If you were to say to me, ‘She could come back right now, we could undo that,’ it would mean I’d be the one gone. I don’t know who would be here.” Again, what is missing highlights what is left.

Memorial Drive makes clear that the dead are more than their absence, the blank space where there was once a body, a life.

This admission reminds Trethewey of a moment that took place shortly after Turnbough escaped her abusive marriage. During a Friday night football game, Grimmette appeared in the stands as Trethewey stood with the other cheerleaders on the field. When she saw him, she waved, and only later discovered that he’d planned to shoot her that night as punishment for her mother leaving. Near the end of this section in Memorial Drive, Trethewey writes that, theoretically, her mother’s murder would have been impossible had Grimmette killed her first, a sentiment she echoes during our call. “For a long time, it felt to me like I had traded my life for hers,” she explains. 

However, loss and self-preservation are never mutually exclusive, and Memorial Drive makes clear that the dead are more than their absence, the blank space where there was once a body, a life. The book ends with the singular image of Turnbough’s still-beating heart, a choice that was influenced by a trip Trethewey took to South Korea. Over the phone, she paraphrases what a local poet told her during her visit. “One does not bury the mother’s body in the ground, but in the chest. Or, like you,” he said, turning to her, “you carry her corpse on your back.” Trethewey admits the observation was, at first, deeply painful, but over the years it has come to represent the ways her mother’s death and life live on. “I have planted my mother like a seed in my chest, in my heart—that’s the living mother,” Trethewey tells me. “The memory of my living mother grows every day; it continues to grow. And I carry her corpse on my back at the same time. And I wouldn’t dare put it down, and don’t want to.”

 

Poet Destiny O. Birdsong is author of the forthcoming collection Negotiations (Tin House).

Author photo © Nancy Crampton

Even when she’s recalling her own painful past, Trethewey is, at heart, a historian. “I’m someone who likes documentary evidence,” she says from her home outside Chicago. “I can tell you how remarkable my mother was, and resilient, and strong, and rational. Or I can show you.”
Interview by

In We Keep the Dead Close, Becky Cooper uncovers the true story of Jane Britton, a graduate student in Harvard’s anthropology department who was found dead in her apartment in 1969. This 10-year investigation straddles the line between memoir and mystery, and the result is unlike any true crime book you've read.

We chatted with Cooper about her kinship with Jane, her transformation into an investigative journalist and the community she found along the way.


What is the significance of the book's title, We Keep the Dead Close?
When I first heard the story about Jane Britton’s murder, the rumor was that she had been murdered by her adviser with whom she was allegedly having an affair. Though that rumor would eventually prove false, that professor was a real person who still taught at Harvard. I decided to audit his class, and during one of his lessons, he said, in reference to the people of ’Ain Mallaha, “They kept the dead close.” The people of that settlement had buried their loved ones under the living areas in their houses. In fact, archaeologists believe that the population’s beliefs and ritual behavior were the reasons people settled there, rather than agriculture.

Even in that moment, back in 2012, I knew the quote would play a significant role in Jane’s story. It encapsulated so many things. I loved the idea that remembering the dead was maybe one of the earliest marks of our humanity. I also loved how ambiguous the nature of “keeping something close” is. Are you hiding it? Are you defending yourself with it? Is it an act of nostalgia? A tribute?

Over the course of working on the book, the ambiguity of that closeness mirrored the myriad ways people relate to the past, and to the dead specifically. How does someone grieve? How does someone honor what came before? Is it through telling and retelling the story of that person? Or is it by refusing to talk about it and, in that way, refusing to wield that story for your own purposes? The stories of our past and the stories of our dead can be molded, as that same professor said in class, to suit the demands of the present. I wanted the book to be an exploration of the ways in which we—as individuals, historians, detectives and archaeologists—keep our dead close, and what that reveals about who we are and what society we live in.

“I have trouble with true crime when it’s salacious or gratuitously violent—when it’s entertainment consumed without a sense of the victim’s humanity or the loss suffered by his or her community.”

Your kinship with Jane Britton is woven throughout the book. Now that the mystery of her murder is seemingly solved and your book is complete, do you still feel that closeness?
Jane still feels like a very dear friend (if you can say that without knowing if the other person would have liked you at all), but I don’t feel the same hallucinatory blurring I did at the height of researching and writing the book. When I was retyping the cache of Jane’s letters, for example, Jane felt as real to me as my own past did. It didn’t help that I was still adjusting to life at Harvard, and I felt surrounded by the ghosts of what had come before. But the new distance between us feels less like a loss than like she’s let me be at peace.

I think part of it is the resolution I feel from finishing her story, but another part of it is that the book captures me at a slightly younger stage of life. One reason I was able to channel Jane was that she and I shared a lot of the same essential preoccupations: a fear of being unlovable in some fundamental way, an inexplicable loneliness, a yearning to feel like I was made of a cohesive whole. I knew instinctively that I had to finish the book before I forgot those worries and that yearning, and before I fell happily in love.

In the year since finishing the first draft, I’ve felt more at peace with myself than I think Jane ever had the chance to feel. In other words, I was allowed to get older, and that fact only underlines the unfairness that Jane’s world stopped at 23.


ALSO IN BOOKPAGE: Read our starred review of We Keep the Dead Close.


Intense experiences, such as those involving death, can unexpectedly bind people together. Have you developed friendships with anyone you interviewed for the book?
I feel very close to a number of the people in the book. Mike Widmer (the former journalist who was also pushing for the Middlesex records) would get coffee with me every few months or so at Flour Bakery in Harvard Square. I visited Don Mitchell (Jane’s friend and neighbor) for Labor Day weekend. Stephen Loring (Anne Abraham’s boyfriend at the time of her disappearance), thank goodness, still sends me postcards.

But I’ve been hesitant to blur the line from journalist into friend completely before the book comes out. Janet Malcolm’s warning that all journalism is an act of betrayal (forgive the paraphrase) preys on my mind. I wanted to be able to write an honest book, and I didn’t want the people in the book to forget that I came into their lives first and foremost as a journalist. I also wanted to limit how bereft I would feel if and when those people were dissatisfied with my account and ended our relationship. My hope, though, is that they will read the book, we will have an honest discussion, and we’ll be able to form a friendship on a foundation that isn’t transactional in nature.

We Keep the Dead CloseYour undergraduate thesis was a biography of David Foster Wallace. What did you learn (either emotionally or practically speaking) about researching a person’s life and death from doing your thesis?
I was terrified by the idea of writing my thesis about David Foster Wallace. It felt too personal and too daunting. I toyed with the idea of writing about maps—some safe, literary-theory friendly chapters about the politics of memory and space. But the idea of writing about Wallace just wore me down through its insistence. So I guess what I learned most is that I should lean into the feeling of feverish identification, because the desire to write my way through it isn’t going to go anywhere. In fact, writing what scares and haunts me is the only way I imagine I’ll care enough about the material for the time it takes to write it.

The other thing I learned is not to allow admiration for my subject to blind me to that person’s flaws and inconsistencies. My thesis was too hagiographic; I idolized Wallace and failed to examine his treatment of women, for example. I’ve tried to correct that with Jane. My love for her was made deeper by an exploration of her complexities, and I’ve tried to convey that in the book.

Was We Keep the Dead Close your first foray into investigative journalism?
In terms of investigative journalism that I’ve actually published—yes, this book is my first foray into investigative journalism. The book is a meta kind of bildungsroman in that way, with the coming-of-age part partially about learning how to be a journalist. When I say that I shaped my life around Jane, I truly did, for about eight years, make every decision based on whether it led me closer to finishing her story.

Were there points along the way in the 10 years it took to write this book when an aspect of the research felt insurmountable and you thought about giving up? If so, how did you push past it?
The moment I think I came closest to putting the book project down was after I spoke with Jane's brother, Boyd, for the first time and he painted a picture of Jane that was at odds with who I had imagined her to be. It wasn't that I ever expected her to be a perfect victim—not that there is one—but I had so subconsciously identified with her that I was thrown off by her stubborn refusal to be me. Obviously I needed to take a moment to both get to know her on her own terms and also come to terms with the fact that I had been projecting myself onto her. I wasn't just too close; I had been blind. To do this right, I had to get to know her separately from who I wanted her to be. Would I still feel so deeply passionate about her story if that illusion of oneness was dissolved? The rupture took a few months of space and reflection to cauterize.

Was it helpful to be working at the New Yorker for a period of time, surrounded by some of the world’s best journalists, while you were writing this book? Or was researching a story of this magnitude difficult to do while working at a demanding full-time job?
When I took the job at the New Yorker, I had just started my first real round of reporting. I had spoken to Boyd, Elisabeth Handler and Ingrid Kirsch and visited the archives for the first time. I worried that taking an office job at that point was a kind of cloaked cowardice; I was walking away from the story while telling myself I was walking toward it. The job was a two-year commitment.

I'm so grateful I said yes, though. While the job did take me away from the book in some sense—I had to wait two and a half years before going on my reporting trip out west, and I had to relegate research to mornings and weekends––I don't think I could have done this book without it. The opportunity at the New Yorker was extraordinary.

Partially, I had been so exhausted trying to make ends meet in New York City that I didn’t have the energy to fully devote all my resources to Jane anyway. I felt like I needed a place to moor. Professionally, the generosity of the New Yorker staff was both unexpected and unparalleled. And finally, when I cold-called people in Jane's life, being able to say that, yes, I'm only 20-something years old, but I have the credibility of the New Yorker magazine behind me, was a complete game changer in terms of what doors were open to me.

Were you initially thinking this story could be a magazine article, or did you suspect from the beginning that We Keep the Dead Close would be a book-length narrative?
At the beginning, I wasn't thinking in terms of a writing project. Her death felt less like a mystery and more like an open secret, and it bothered me that people believed the rumor enough to repeat it but not enough to do anything about it. I wanted to be the one to take it seriously. As the story became more complex, I felt compelled to pursue it as far as it would go, even if the chances of solving the crime were increasingly slim. I hoped I would at least find peace with the project. That trail took years to follow. It started to change my identity by guiding all my decisions. Naturally then, as the narrative took shape, it blew past the outlines of anything other than a book-length story.

“No one person is the source for the authoritative version of history. It's important to collect myriad perspectives in order to capture an event as it's remembered.”

For many journalists who write about sexual violence and violence against women, the work can feel emotionally draining and despairing. Was this your experience while researching Jane Britton and Anne Abraham (another young archaeologist who disappeared in 1976)? If so, how did you cope with it?
I don't know whether it was conscious, but instead of focusing on the loss of Jane and Anne and the injustice of what their early deaths deprived them of, I focused on how lucky I felt to be spending time with women like them. I relished every moment I got to read another poetic journal entry or speak to the people with whom they had surrounded themselves. I don’t think I could have worked on this book for 10 years without the sense of hope I found in that community. The solace we felt in finding each other was extremely buoying.

You are critical of the entertainment aspect that can crop up within the true crime genre. What was your relationship to the true crime genre while working on this book?
I didn’t intentionally position the book to be a commentary on the true crime genre. It’s true that I have trouble with true crime when it’s salacious or gratuitously violent, when it’s entertainment consumed without a sense of the victim’s humanity or the loss suffered by his or her community or when the genre glorifies the killer. But rather than writing a book in the negative (i.e., I never said, “I don’t want to write a book that . . .”), I just set out to write one I would want to read.

The books I’m drawn to are rich character studies and philosophical explorations of moral ambiguity. The north stars for my book include In Cold Blood (though not in terms of the journalistic liberties Capote took), Alex Marzano-Lesnevich’s The Fact of a Body, Janet Malcolm’s The Silent Woman, Maggie Nelson’s Jane and The Red Parts and Melanie Thernstrom’s The Dead Girl. But my inspirations were also genre and form agnostic. The literary devices and character explorations in the book are equally indebted to "The Keepers," "Twin Peaks," Jelani Cobb’s This American Life segment “Show Me State of Mind,” Anna Burns’ Milkman, Nabokov’s Pale Fire and Lolita, Susan Orlean’s The Orchid Thief and Laurent Binet’s HHhH.

It may seem odd, but I sometimes didn’t even classify We Keep the Dead Close as a true crime book in my mind. It was a biography of Jane occasioned by her death, or a portrait of her community as impacted by the crime. In fact, that shared understanding was one of the reasons I decided to work with my editor Maddie Caldwell, who, from the very first meeting, focused more on the book’s repetition of the ritual motif rather than on its entry in the true crime genre.

You went down a lot of rabbit holes in your research and mentioned in another interview that your first draft came in 30% too long. What was a rabbit hole that you found fascinating but didn’t/couldn’t delve into?
I had always been intrigued by the whispers that there was some kind of government connection to the Iranian dig that Jane participated in the summer before her death. After all, the second time I heard the story about Jane was during a discussion of how commonly archaeology had been used as a cover for espionage. This avenue of speculation wasn't helped by the fact that the CIA was the only agency I queried that gave a glomar response. (This means they could neither confirm nor deny the existence of files relating to either Jane or to Tepe Yahya.)

Research led me to a man named Ted Wertime, who was the head of metallurgical survey team at Tepe Yahya in 1968 when Jane was there. It was thanks to Wertime that the Iranian expedition secured U.S. commissary privileges. He had been trained in hand-to-hand combat by the Office of Strategic Services, the precursor to the CIA. And he was, for a time, the cultural attaché in Iran, which is about as stereotypical as you can get for a CIA cover. Finally, according to his son's memoir, when the son learned that Wertime had died, his first thought was, “You're finally safe.”

I ultimately got nowhere with that line of research; I could find no evidence that Wertime was still working in intelligence at the time of the dig, and the Harvard professor who ran Tepe Yahya vehemently denied ever working for the U.S. government. Without any of the dots connecting, I couldn’t justify putting any more than a hint of it in the main text, where it serves more as a reminder of my state of mind. A little is relegated to the source notes.

The two books you’ve written so far (Mapping Manhattan and We Keep the Dead Close) are extremely different. Do you have plans for a third book, and if so, can you tell us what it will be about?
On the surface, I completely agree that my books are very different, but I think what bonds them is the idea that no one person is the source for the authoritative version of either history or of a map. It's important to collect myriad perspectives in order to capture an event as it's remembered—or a city as it’s lived. I imagine anything I write will land close to this territory.

As for what comes next, I have a few things in mind, and I’m waiting to see if they’ll gain mass and inevitability. I’m especially curious to see if I can find something that is endlessly interesting but doesn't require what feels like soul scraping. I would love to be surprised.


ALSO IN BOOKPAGE: Discover all the best new true crime.


Author headshot © Lily Erlinger

We chatted with Becky Cooper about her true crime masterpiece, We Keep the Dead Close, her kinship with Jane, her transformation into an investigative journalist and the community she found along the way.

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